Fort St. James (B.C.)

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Fort St. James (B.C.)

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Fort St. James (B.C.)

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Ann Rottacker interview : [Reimer, 1976]

SUPPLIED TITLE OF TAPE(S): Fort St. James, 1862-1914 PERIOD COVERED: 1862-1914 RECORDED: Williams Lake (B.C.), 1976-10-04 SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mrs. Ann A. Rottacker discusses her background: born 1896 in Fort St. James; father, Alexander C. Murray, was the Hudson's Bay Factor; details about father. Fort St. James described: domestic; details; fur trade; relations between Indians and A.C. Murray. Elementary school in Fort St. James. Mrs. Rottacker at school in Victoria for four years. Mrs. Rottacker spoke Carrier as a child. Father A.G. Morice described. Cataline (Jean Caux) described. Travel. Father was at Fort St. James from 1862 to 1914. TRACK 2: Father travelled by snowshoe from Lower Fort Garry to Fort St. James in 1862.; Mrs. Rottacker sings briefly in Carrier. Kitchen garden at Fort St. James described. More on childhood. Route travelled between Fort St. James and Victoria in about 1905. Details of diet. HBC "open house" for Indians described. Clothing described.

Martin Starret interviews, 1966-

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0014
SUPPLIED TITLE OF TAPE(S): Martin Starret and Dick Lattie
RECORDED: Hazelton (B.C.), 1966
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret continues with his story about his arrival in Hazelton in October 1909 on the steamboat. He offers a detailed account of what Hazelton was like, including the stores there and their locations. He talks of pack horses and specific mule trains such as that of Cataline and George Burns. Mr. Starret offers his impressions of Hazelton as he and Mr. Orchard look over the town; he compares Hazelton in 1909 to [1966]. Dick Lattie, born 1895, talks about his life in Hazelton, and he and Mr. Starret recall when they first met in the fall of 1912. Mr. Starret and Mr. Lattie recall leading the Bell Mare pack train to Manson Creek with pipe for the miners. Mr. Lattie cooked and served food for the pack train. Mr. Lattie describes the trail from Hazelton along Babine Road, over the hills to Manson Creek where the miners were mining gold. He describes Manson Creek as it was. The miners there including a Chinese man named Packtrain Joe. Ferrying mules across Takla Lake; Ned Charleston's pack trains; and working for Cataline. TRACK 2: Mr. Lattie continues, discussing: pack trains, the Indian village before Hazelton was founded, where the first white settlements were and how the Indians moved to reservations.The first white man in the area was Charlie Humans [sp?] who moved there to start a store. Mr. Starret describes an Indian chief who had a lot of power, the first one who had a pole carved on the Hazelton reserve. Mr. Lattie discusses the towns in the area before Hazelton was founded and the white people came, and Indian chiefs and their homes. Mr. Lattie discusses trade between the people of Babine and Hazelton; instruments used in ceremonial dances; and the songs used in the ceremonies.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0015
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret discusses a 1909 trip on a Union Steamship vessel, the "Camosun", from Vancouver through Alert Bay to Prince Rupert to meet his mother at Metlakatla. The boys waiting at the dock could not read but bought news papers so as to look educated. Mr. Starret discusses boat travel during fall rains. He offers anecdotes about things that happened on the boat, including a story about a man who was looking for the saloon on the boat and the story of his hardships as told to Mr. Starret. Mr. Starret describes his experience upon landing in Prince Rupert, and the process of getting to Metlakatla and reuniting with his mother. Mr. Starret describes his experiences in Metlakatla, including people's names, a description of the town, and a meeting with Captain Irving. He describes the geography. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret discusses another four-day steamboat trip from Port Essington, up the Skeena River to Hazelton. He describes some of the passengers, including Blackjack McDonald, the cargo (70 tons of liquor for a hotel), the boat itself, the Captain's notion of shallow and deeper water, the condition of the boats, the crew, a character named Turley Hambley who established Hambley's Landing, what staterooms and dining saloons were like on board, the steerage accommodations, Captain Jackman, the scenery, Fred Daniels, and more on the passengers.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0016
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret tells the story of his mother; how she came to Hope at age sixteen to teach school and married his father a year and a half later. Eventually the ranch at Hope was not generating enough money to support the family, so she left with the three children (other than Martin) to teach all over the province. In January 1909, she went to Metlakatla to teach. Mr. Starret discusses people in the [northern BC] area, including Simon Gun-an-noot, other Indians and relationships with Indians. He discusses his experience attending South Park School in Victoria, and never feeling comfortable among the city kids there, and other aspects of his education. He describes his mother's physical appearance, ability as a teacher, her relationship with Martin and his brother, her ability as a fur trader (Fort St. James offered more money for fur than Fort Babine), and her retirement back to the ranch in Hope. Mr. Starret describes the location his uncle's home in Hazelton and the old original miners' cabins before the railroad came through. Mr. Starret tells a story about a time he dug potatoes and wheeled them across town for his uncle. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret describes what Hazelton looked like and what kind of place it was when he first arrived. One feature that distinguished it from other frontier towns was that it had warehouses. He describes the surrounding country and his experiences there, gardening techniques attuned to the landscape and climate, Hazelton's place along the Skeena River, a description of the buildings and their construction, the geography of Fort Babine, and salmon as the staple food of the Indians there. Mr. Starret then describes the town of Burns Lake and the people who lived there.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0017
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret describes his uncle Charles Victor Smith's house in Hazelton which was built by Indians. He goes on to discuss the life of C.V. Smith, including several life stories such as how he came to live in Hazelton. C.V. Smith took over his father's tug boat, until his eyesight began to fail him before he was forty years old. Smith decided to go into the fur business. He began by opening a shop and eventually moved to Hazelton in 1904. Mr. Starret discusses Smith's family including his two daughters. Mr. Starret tells a story about a trip to Babine with his uncle with mention to several Babine natives, attitudes of the Indians, interactions with Indians and details of a pack train. Indians based a storekeepers wealth by how much sugar he kept in stock, C.V. Smith had two hundred pounds on the same boat load which carried Blackjack's liquor. The idea was not to compete with Hudson's Bay Company, but to attract trappers. Mr. Starret tells a story about an Indian packer named Alfred Danes. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret describes how his mother was under the impression that Indians in the north were wild. She was worried about her brother until he assured her that the Indians were the easiest people to get along with in British Columbia. Several anecdotes about how Indians are easy to get along with are offered. Mr. Starret describes a saddle horse trip to Babine with his mother and uncle including the supplies they brought, camping equipment, cooking, the weather, the Indians they were with, anecdotes about the trip, and his mother's stiffness on the trail.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0018
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret describes in great detail the pack trail near Hazelton which was laid out by ex-Governor Dewdney from the goldfields of Babine Lake, through Fort St. James to Manson Creek; including reasons why the trail follows the course it does. Mr. Starret discusses the details surrounding C.V. Smith's trading post at Babine Village including details about local Indians and living conditions. He describes the log house in which the trading post was located and its furniture. Mr. Starret tells a story of the mail carrier Jim Williams who worked at the Babine Hatchery, whose wife lived in Babine Village; and a gift he bought her of a musical clock, and a story of her giving birth to a child which died two days later. Mr. Starret discusses Williams' reaction and the reaction of others in the community. Mr. Starret continues with more on his uncle's trading post and a night when an Indian spent the night with Smith and Mr. Starret's Aunt Agnes. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret discusses Carrier Indians in the Hazelton/Babine region and their church attendance. A church bell would ring and wherever anyone was, they would take off their hats and pray, and then resume work. Mr. Starret discusses the hygiene of the Indians and their living conditions. Mr. Starret describes C.V. Smith including his character and habits with the use of anecdotes. Mr. Starret believes that Smith's stubbornness was what made him successful; and he was a religious man who attended church. Mr. Starret discusses his own reasons for not attending church. Mr. Starret describes Smith's physical appearance including his posture, he always wore a Stetson hat and he would never drink. Mr. Starret describes his aunt Agnes Smith whose father was a coal miner also named Smith. Mr. Starret describes his cousin Clara Smith who was born at Moodyville and offers some stories about her. More on his uncle and how children did not like him. Mr. Starret offers his first impressions of Father Nicholas.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0019
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret offers his impressions of the Carrier Indians as he knew them in the early 1900s: their concentration skills and the ways in which they were brought up, Father Coccola sermonizing; about pre-marital relations, eating in church, religion and superstition. Mr. Starret offers several anecdotes about Father Coccola's interactions with Indians and a story about Father Dominic of Babine Lake who was an Indian that learned commerce from white men. Mr. Starret tells a story about the Father asking Indians "what hell is". Mr. Starret tells a story of Coccola as a young man who never thought he would be a priest, and stories about his old age. The Indian congregations at church in Babine and Stuart Lakes, the men and women sat separately. The Babine tribe consisted of two hundred and twenty-five people at that time and he discusses his feelings about Babine and Fort Connolly. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret describes his daily life at Babine Post: he begins with someone coming into the store to buy sugar and daily chores before getting into specifics such as an interaction with an Indian who tried to cheat him, another story about an Indian woman who came into the store with Hudson's Bay coupons, trading posts, Fort Thompson and the three families there. Mr. Starret relates tall stories as told to him by Eli Ferguson, who was an old timer who had several jobs and skills: an amusing tale about a time before horses were used, when people used oxen to pull yokes. There was a man plowing one morning with a side hill plow but the story is cut short.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0020
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret describes Fort St. James upon his arrival by canoe: the riverbank, the Hudson's Bay post, the layout of the town, a description of the houses and a few characters there, where the Indians lived in a place called the Rancherie, there was always one priest there. Mr. Starret discusses Father Coccola and his journeys all over the province. Mr. Starret describes his first trip into the Bulkley Valley to Round Lake in April 1911, to survey property for his uncle; including the landscape and characters he encountered. Mr. Starret describes his journey to Ootsa Lake in 1917 to buy fur at the time when Indians were bringing in beaver, including traveling with Father Coccola and having to borrow $2,000.00 from his uncle. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret tells the story of his uncle who wan;ted Martin to acquire Indian artifacts, one such artifact was Qua's dagger. Mr. Starret describes who Qua was. Mr. Starret tells the story of Sir James Douglas and his relations with the native people. The natives were upset about how he treated them. Douglas was sent to Stuart Lake to be an apprentice to the factor from an eastern post. During the factor's absence, there was trouble between the Indians and white people over the apprehension of a murderer. Eventually Douglas became Sir James Douglas, Governor of British Columbia. The natives became upset with the prices of goods which the Hudson's Bay Post supplied once the goods were shipped by steamboat. Mr. Starret discusses the value and quality of a variety of Hudson's Bay goods and trade with the Indians.

CALL NUMBER: T0399:0021
RECORDED: [location unknown], [196-]
SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Starret discusses his belief that Carrier Indians always trusted the priests. Mr. Starret never heard anything negative said by the Carrier Indians about the Church until World War I, when there was a disagreement about discipline. Mr. Starret offers some anecdotes which offer insight into the relationship between the Indians and priests. Mr. Starret discusses and sings a song by A.J. Hamilton which came about around the time of WWI about home-brewed alcohol. Mr. Starret offers his final feelings about the country including the way he would like to remember it such as paddling along in a canoe at night and hearing a loon call. Mr. Starret discusses the attitude of the Indians that all white men are rich. Mr. Starret discusses the attitudes of people in the past as compared to people at the time of the interview. Mr. Starret tells a story of an Indian who was unjustly punished named Francis Prince who was ostracized by the community. There were no white men who were Catholics in the area but Indians were. Mr. Starret believes that priests were fair legal advisors who did not necessarily give favour to white men over Indians. TRACK 2: Mr. Starret offers his opinions on British Columbia and how it is not really a part of Canada. He feels that there is a division at the Rockies and that Americans are like cousins as their money has helped develop Canada. Mr. Starret discusses free trade and his view that British Columbia's way of doing things is the best and he thinks that the Government in BC is the best at the date of this taping. Mr. Orchard and Mr. Starret discuss politics. Mr. Starret prefers working outdoors and he always recognized himself as a Canadian, yet when he first took up land, he had to do it as a British subject, people were not recognized as Canadians in those days. Mrs. Starret, born 1904, describes her life as her father moved from Ontario in 1918 to Burns Lake. She describes her views of Canada and BC as a part of Canada.

William Ferrier interview

CALL NUMBER: T1042:0001 RECORDED: [location unknown], 1965-10-31 SUMMARY:

TRACK 1: Mr. Bill Ferrier came to Canada from Scotland in 1910 to visit his sister in Victoria when he was 20 years old. He describes working in the East on his way out to Victoria; various jobs including working for a vet in Victoria and as a gun toter in a carnival and building a poultry farm; a three-year contract as a transport boss for the HBC at Babine; travel from Hazelton to Babine by dog team; his experiences in Hazelton; experiences with the local people including the packer Cataline (Jean Caux) and what life was like there; the Babine hatchery, poor fish hatchers; A.C. Murray, who; was the old factor at the HBC Fort at Fort St. James, and the hierarchy of the surrounding forts; jobs he worked at in Fort St. James; more on fishing and life at the hatchery from 1922 to 1928; how he got his dogs, and how he learned to use the dogs on a dog team. TRACK 2: Mr. Ferrier continues by describing Barney Mulvaney on the Babine Trail, Mary L. Jobe, delivering freight with schooners and other vessels on the Skeena River, fur packing and missionaries.

CALL NUMBER: T1042:0002 RECORDED: [location unknown], 1965-10-31 SUMMARY: TRACK 1: Mr. Ferrier describes Father Coccola and Father Woolfe in detail; Christmas celebrations; Native Indians; Martin Starret and his relationship with Indians, and the story of how Ferrier met Starret in 1913; anecdotes about Starret and Ferrier's experiences together; more on the Babine area; the HBC post at Babine; Fort St. James and the HBC post there; A.C. Murray and his family. [TRACK 2;: blank.]